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Did cadmium cause breast cancer in 3 sisters?

2005

CHECKING FOR MORE INFO ON POSSIBLE CADMIUM CAUSED BREAST CANCER IN MY 3 SISTERS.
I am Jules Schultetus 75 years old, and live in Cashires NC. Two years ago I had 3 sisters with breast cancer at the same time. Their birth years are 1924, 1926, and 1939. They are all in remission now, and are in good health now. The one thing that stands out in why they all had breast cancer (maybe) is that in 1939, what was called a cyclone hit our farm in Southern Illinois, blew down our barn and damaged the cedar roof shingles on our house.. The shingles were replaced at that time, with corrugated galvanized roof sheets.
Also at that time galvanized guttering was installed that were used to fill our cistern (with runoff from the roof) which was our only water supply for all uses. A newspaper article about 6 months ago said small amounts of cadmium can cause breast cancer. Is there any additional information that might shed more light on this. An investigation of genetics being a cause has been checked and is said not to be a factor.

Jules Schultetus
cadmium in galvanized roof. - Cashiers, North Carolina

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The International Cadmium Association at http://www.cadmium.org/ has some articles on line that probably won't really answer your question, but may be a start towards digging deeper.

Ted Mooney, P.E.
Striving to live Aloha
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
2005

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2005

The original work on breast cancer and cadmium was published in July 2003 and states that there MIGHT be a link between the two. The original work was done using rats injected with an equivalent dose to humans and the results show that there MAY be an increase in risk to pregnant females. The hypothesis is that cadmium can induce effects similar to the female hormone estrogen and can manifest itself in both the mother and (female) child. One of the problems with this type of research is that the results are usually guarded by caveats and other exclusion phrases, but the popular press gets hold of it and assumes it is a signed and sealed deal; very often this is not the case. I note that your sisters were only just born, 13 and 15 when the cyclone hit, so I would suspect they would not be in a condition that the cadmium work suggests. Saying this, I am not aware of any subsequent work on this and there could be something deeper in it. I also note that you say there is no genetic commonality in the incidents, despite the three subjects being sisters. Perhaps this should be rechecked? I trust you are in good health, but are (quite rightly) concerned the chance of succumbing to the disease. I hope you do not, and continue in good health. If you continue to be worried, as Ted says, contact the Cadmium Development Association (CDA), as they have an excellent portfolio on health related issues.

Trevor Crichton
R&D practical scientist
Chesham, Bucks, UK

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2005

Since there is no cadmium in the galvanising coating, I can't see how there can be the slightest link between galvanised roofing material and any possible effects from ingesting cadmium.

Where do you gentlemen hypothesize that the cadmium would come from?

Bill Reynolds [deceased]
consultant metallurgist - Ballarat, Victoria, Australia
We sadly relate the news that Bill passed away on Jan. 29, 2010.

That's a good question, Bill. Cadmium is a by-product of zinc mining, but hot dipping is only done with zinc as far as I know. Do you know the maximum cadmium concentration that is allowed in hot dip galvanizing, either by law or due to the contamination causing defects in the coating?

In the electroplating field, cadmium ball anodes are hard to distinguish from zinc ball anodes and, in the days when a lot of cadmium plating was done, it was all too common to accidentally put the wrong balls in the tanks :-)

But hot dipping is a different matter I'm sure.

Ted Mooney, P.E.
Striving to live Aloha
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
2005

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First of three simultaneous responses -- 2005

Following is some info from data sheets published by Zinifex Limited (the Australian producer of zinc and lead). It seems reasonable to believe that USA practice would be similar. These are material property data, not limits imposed by health authorities - the following consideration of the material property data will I believe show that there is no need for health authorities to concern themselves.

Zinc for galvanising complies with the USA standard ASTM B6-23 Special High Grade (and also with corresponding Australian, Japanese, ISO, and European standards), which restrict cadmium to a maximum of 20 parts per million (ppm). Typical actual content is 5 ppm.

Some, perhaps most, hot dip galvanisers run with a layer of lead in the bottom of the zinc kettle, the weight of this lead layer often being around 5% of the weight of the zinc. Standard lead product has a specified maximum cadmium content of 10 ppm.

In the zinc kettle, there is no reason to believe that the cadmium originally in the lead layer would ultimately report in the zinc, or vice versa. But if we hypothesize an absolute worst-case situation with all of the cadmium reporting in the zinc, the zinc would then contain typically 6 ppm.

The flux used in the galvanising process does not contain cadmium, nor does any of the steel being galvanised, so there is no source other than the above.

This puts 6 ppm of cadmium in the zinc layer on the galvanised product. While the zinc layer continues to exist then the cadmium in the zinc necessarily remains there - it cannot be dissolved out of the solid zinc.

Over many years, depending on the particular climatic environment, the zinc layer may slowly corrode away, taking the few parts per million of cadmium with it. I suggest this would provide an amount of cadmium many, many orders of magnitude less than required to have any effect on living organisms (including people). The zinc itself, being present at a level 150,000 times higher than cadmium, would seem to be the greater potential risk, although a century or so of use of galvanised roofing and tanks around the world hasn't shown any problems.

I rather think that a genetic predisposition is much more likely to be the cause of the pattern of breast cancer occurrence.

Bill Reynolds [deceased]
consultant metallurgist - Ballarat, Victoria, Australia
We sadly relate the news that Bill passed away on Jan. 29, 2010.

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Second of three simultaneous responses -- 2005

Cadmium naturally occurs with zinc and can sometimes be found in low concentrations with zinc salts. There has been a case in the UK (Kent actually) where an overzealous environmental enforcement officer pointed out to a zinc plater that he did not have a consent to handle cadmium. When the plater pointed out he did not plate cadmium, the officer was able to show there to be cadmium present in the zinc plate, albeit in very low concentrations. The plater had clearly been using commercial zinc salts that contained small traces of cadmium salts, so it may not always a good idea to use cheaper, impure, materials.

Trevor Crichton
R&D practical scientist
Chesham, Bucks, UK

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Third of three simultaneous responses -- 2005

Not being a galvanizer, I'm not certain, but isn't most galvanized product coated in a (typically, especially in the past) hex-chrome conversion coat? If I'm correct in that, Jules might want to look into the effects of that known carcinogen and how likely it is to leach out of the coating in those circumstances.

Or am I completely wrong on that?

Jim Gorsich
Compton, California, USA

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I was wondering if you can get bladder cancer from welding galvanized metal. My husband got bladder cancer after he went to work for a company that was welding galvanized pipe. The company had its workers working inside the building without any ventilation. Denise Tosta consumer - Red Bluff, California 2005 Hi, Denise. We have many threads on line about welding galvanized materials. It definitely should not be done without adequate ventilation because it is known to cause flu-like "metal fume fever". But I do not think anyone has established any link to cancer of any kind. Please continue the discussion under one of the related threads. Thanks. Regards, Ted Mooney, P.E. Striving to live Aloha finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey

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I've been watching this one for a while pondering what I could add when it finally hit me - we stopped doing nickel/cadmium diffused plating because even at low baking temperatures, cadmium can volatilize and become airborne. That being the case, how much cadmium can there be in molten zinc? If the cancer were to occur in the galvanizing house employee, I could see that, however, from the galvanized gutters - I'd think not!

Milt Stevenson, Jr.
Syracuse, New York
2005

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While I am really sorry for the fact that your sisters suffered from breast cancer, being a cancer survivor myself, I would encourage you to stop worrying about this unbelievably unlikely cause, breast cancer being the most common cancer in women and with hundreds of suggested possible causes, and at this late stage of life, the stress in chasing possible reasons and impossible to prove, is more likely to shorten your lives.

Geoffrey Whitelaw
- Port Melbourne, Australia
2005

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February 11, 2008

Hi,
Very interested in the article on cadmium and its possible link with breast cancer. In County Meath we have a large underground lead/zinc mine producing 2.5 million tons of concentrate per year. The mine has extensive overground concentrator mill facilities including train siding and a shipping storage building at Dublin Port. The mine also has a 600 acre tailings pond containing approx. 35 million tons of waste, various heavy metals including cadmium and many waste process chemicals including arsenic. Are there any reports on the health risk to both miners and workers in such lead zinc mines as I know cadmium exists in this mines' orebody. Any other health affects on nearby residents, schools close to the mine/mill facility. Another concern is whether people within say 1 or 2 miles of the 600 acre tailings/waste dam using water from ground based wells surrounding the 600 acre waste/tailings pond/dam. Also the possible likely affect on the nearby town which gets its raw water for the town's public water supply from a river which is fed by a small stream which flows past the 600 acre tailings/waste/dam. We seem to have high incidences of cancer including breast cancers, prostate cancers etc and many of the mine workers both retired and still working in the mine have died from cancer. There have been a high number of irritable bowl and colitis and also a high number of brain tumors. Many of those people with the brain tumors would have got their potable water from wells from the same limestone rock containing the lead zinc orebody which is in close proximity to the mine in question.

I have queried the local Health Board as to whether a base study of health of the town's (10,000 population based within 1 mile of the mine) community was carried out prior to the mine commencing. I was told there was a study but apparently and I do genuinely not know if I am being deliberately being obstructed but I have failed to discover any such report/base study? I am seeking discover of documents / access to all files from our Local Authority and lack of co-operation to provide access to the files / reports is unbelievable and is worrying! The mine in County Meath has been in operation since 1977 and presently employs approx. 650.

I wish to thank all who may/might wish to contribute to my query on cadmium and the production of lead and zinc in our locality. The orebody contains about 2 to 3% Lead (and about 0.5% silver)and about 8 to 10% of Zinc plus of course many other heavy metals including cadmium. I am also concerned about the perpetual stability of the tailings dam (when the mine eventually closes) which will eventually contain about 50 million tons of waste/toxic chemicals/heavy metals which is located upstream about 3 kilometers of the nearby town and a major water source for about a further 100,000 souls, i.e. river Boyne which flows about 30 miles to the Irish Sea which might become polluted from any major breach of the mines tailings dam walls which stand at a height of approx. 60 feet about surrounding ground level? Incidentally, the 600 acre tailings pond can be clearly seen on Google Earth about 3 kilometers north on Navan, County Meath.

I take this opportunity to thank any person/researcher/scientists for any assistance, advice or guidance I as a public elected representative (I am an independent and not affiliated to any politically party) may receive in the long term health interests of our community, both urban and rural.

Cllr. Phillip Cantwell,
Meath County Council
Trim Town Council
Ireland
Ps my details are on the web - again many thanks.

Councillor Phillip Cantwell
- Trim, County Meath, Ireland

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Hi
I have Lead and Cadmium levels in my blood though low they say it can only have occurred from the drinking water that comes through galvanized pipes; this exposure has been for a long time research shows that they cannot tell the level on the bones only by an x-ray fluorescence which the only one in this country is broken, my understanding is the galvanized dip on the pipe leaches into the water as the pipe rusts you will first get a high reading of zinc.

Carol Krogseter
- Darwin, Northern Territory, Australia
December 4, 2009

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December , 2009

Hi, Carol. You don't say who "they" are who are so familiar with your life that they have eliminated every single other possible source of exposure to cadmium and lead except galvanized pipes. But as noted several times already, galvanized coatings are zinc, not cadmium, and the amount of cadmium that might be in them is minuscule. So I think "they" are probably wrong. Good luck.

Regards,

Ted Mooney, P.E.
Striving to live Aloha
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey

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Dear Ted
Hi
Read what you had to say but would like to say that galvanized piping does have cadmium in it and most like it is the wrong one that was use for there are more then one type, galvanized piping is now considered non-portable for fluid in most countries, stainless steel, is to be used for milk, has been known to become contaminated, stainless steel was ordered to be used for milk and milk products late fifties, so why hasn't been used for other products --do you have shares in a galvanized factory? -- there is a full report by APEC of all the experiments that were done on animal quite depressing , if you have any other idea how people can be come contaminated let me know, for even collecting water of a roof or storing water in a galvanized material DRINK AT YOUR OWN RISK HOW DOES IT GET INTO THE WATER?

America had up to 1986 to have all galvanized and lead pipe and welding removed.
I have had the water tested positive so where else do you say it is coming from

Carol Krogseter
- Darwin, Northern Territory, Australia
April 8, 2010

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Maybe someone else will answer, Carol, but when your response to my attempt to answer your question is to insult my integrity, you've worn out your welcome. Bye.

Ted Mooney, P.E.
Striving to live Aloha
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
April 8, 2010