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Blade mfgr. can't find soak cleaner that works without ultrasonics

2003

Could anyone tell me please if I really have to install ultrasonics into my degreaser tank for better cleaning of "non-synthetic petroleum based honing oil" (aka grinding coolant) from 300 and 400 stainless parts? Or there is a miracle alkaline solution which works well without sonicating the parts in this soak cleaner. I thought I could get away without ultrasonics in our new immersion cleaning tank. I got no good results so far with the cleaning solutions I tried. Especially I can not eliminate inorganic soil (wipe test with alcohol) although I even went up to holding the parts 12 minutes with air agitation at 170 F with the detergents I have tried. I really believe there must be some special product for my case. Finding the right solution is quite time consuming if I have to search bunch of options and test samples and stuff.

Thanks.

TB [last name deleted for privacy by Editor]
- Staunton, Virginia

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2003

Hi T,

I am surprised that you cannot get these parts clean in 12 minutes at 170 F in an agitated immersion. In your various attempts, did you maximize the concentration of the cleaner? Perhaps your cleaner simply isn't up to the job for this soil. Have you contacted your pretreatment supplier for a more robust product?

It's hard to tell whether you have the right cleaner for this soil, but is the soil aged on the parts or maybe burned on there, thus making it more difficult to remove?

I don't know whether an ultrasonic cleaning approach will necessarily help in your situation. You should test the strongest heavy-duty alkaline cleaner having high detergency that you can find and see how that works before installing a new system.

George Gorecki
- Naperville, Illinois

George,

I always used maximum concentration. So far I have tested three different alkaline cleaners. I just got frustrated. Getting cleaner samples and testing and optimizing the parameters and repeat this for different sample solutions over and over again... We have also an automatic cleaning system with ultrasonics built in. I cleaned the same parts there and they look perfect. I used the same solution in this soak cleaner without ultrasonics then I saw inorganic soil residue. Our pretreatment supplier suggested some other type of cleaner which would supposedly works better without ultrasonics (more robust I guess). That did not change the residual soil situation. That is why I thought maybe For our type of soil ultrasonic cleaning is necessary. As you mentioned, this type of soil is probably burned on the surface , and it is difficult to remove type of soil.

Thanks for your suggestions.

TB [last name deleted for privacy by Editor]
- Staunton, Virginia
2003

Have you tried vapor degreasing? I know in CT (California East) that many firms have gone away from it, but there are just some parts that nothing else works well. Buying ultrasonics for an existing tank is not like buying a microwave at sears. The proper one will work so much better than an almost correct one.

James Watts
- Navarre, Florida
2003

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2003

1. I am sorry to say responding on the last remark, vapor degreasing will not function with oil that is burned-in and isn't suitable for removing inorganic solids. That is the strength of an aqueous ultrasonic system.

2. degreasing agents for ultrasonic cleaning are different in composition. To keep the ultrasonic waves "working" the solution has to be as clear as possible. That is why emulsifying degreasing agents mostly are not suitable for use in ultrasonic systems. "Heavy" Soak cleaners often are emulsifying types.

In my experience it will be hard to find the degreasing agent with the same result as the one with ultrasonics. The cleaner has to contain a dispersing agent to take-up solid particles next to the degreasing agent to remove oil and grease. A good supplier (manufacturer) of degreasing agents that knows about the working of the different degreasing components could help you.

Dolf van den Berg
- Leusden, The Netherlands

In response to Dolf's #1. I do not consider a hone to "Burn in " the oil as the abrasive removal with the cold temperatures will not cause it to be an organo metallic. You are correct that vapor degreasers do not really remove inorganic material, however, the initial high condensation will flush away some types of inorganics (but not all) and you certainly would not leave it in any longer than when the condensation -Just quit_ or you will be in mechanical methods of removal. Now the joy- How much of the grit is embedded into the parent metal? An ugly thought. It would be nice to also know what kind of a "blade" this is.

James Watts
- Navarre, Florida
2003