Sound technical content, curated with aloha by
Ted Mooney, P.E. RET
Pine Beach, NJ
The authoritative public forum
for Metal Finishing since 1989
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Recovering gold from electronics, page 6
Everyone is wanting the same thing and that's just to do this as cheap as possible and as safe as possible. I can tell you a way that is very cost effective and very safe. One chemical to buy and it gets the gold off the PCB and then you can reuse the chemical to do more. It doesn't work on the CPUs but it is very good on any of the memory or circuit boards. Very simple folks go to RADIO SHACK and get a bottle or 2 of etching solution for around $4.00 a bottle and then soak the gold PCB parts in it, the gold floats to the top. What this is doing is melting away the copper under the gold and there ya have it. Now strain the gold and move on to the next set. I have tried many ways and this is the easiest and safest for the boards. The rest isn't enough to mess with I sell them and take what I can get for them.
John Wilson- Charlotte, North Carolina
2007
2007
Hi all,
I have studied the e waste recycle path from collection to refinery, I am just starting an e waste biz.. well, I have seen a lot of people doing refinery in non environmental friendly way... from what I am thinking if you want to make it a biz, we need to plan it in the environmental and economic balance way... what I have seen so far, it is not legal and not safe either to perform the refinery yourself. I am currently planning the biz more to every process before the refinery, that will actually make profits to you ; even if you dun continue yourself to the final refinery path, so you just sell it... but if you do like to continue for further profit, you could find a professional refiner, calculate the transportation and handling fees... including the law and regulation in your country... the numbers will tell you whether is it worth?
Of course you will need to know what material are you having? I used to send my material for element analysis, so I have confidence on the % material that I am going to recover. Sending it to the pro refiner which you can check what metals they able to recover, as in e waste... there are (PM)Au, Ag, Pd, Pt and Cu, Ni, Sn, Fe, Al (BM)... a most ideal refiner is with low cost then with capability of recovery most of the expected elements.
So that makes up the biz plan. of coz it needs to be in quantity.... if you are just having a little of the e scrap, I will not think this will come into a profit... coz only the huge quantity makes bucks in the scrap market refinery...
I am in my last part planning which to look for the refiners and calculating the expenses vs expected revenue... so in short I still do not have any data to prove this plan is earning...
p/s: some of the big boys refiner, r2japan, Heraeus, Umicore... which I think is trustable and reliable one.
Well, that's only my 2 cent of idea... there is no concrete data that it will work yet.. so I will be glad to receive comment...thanks.
- Malaysia
I have been attempting to get information on how to separate scrap gold from jewelry using chemical mixes however, I need assistance in knowing the percentage of acids, volts for the usage of electric, distance, voltage, etc. recovery of gold from solution. If anyone can assisted me I would appreciate this as I do have a chemist assistance but he is requesting additional information before the usage of anymore chemicals so we will not lose any more gold.
Ramona DuBois- San Rafael, New Mexico
2007
Okay - I am a retired(?) male with average intelligence and a huge factor of curiosity. I have been for years taking old computers and tearing them down for the precious metals and such. Recently I have read so much on chemical extractions and such that I thought maybe I would try that. I did purchase some nitric acid, hydrochloric and several other types. THEN I sit myself down and had one heck of a talk with myself. Result - the acids stay in the bottles and I continue doing what I have been doing. I don't figure the risk of using the different acids are worth the returns. Instead I do take the boards and clip off the connectors, then I use either a small sharp chisel or such to take all the parts off the boards. Then I reverse the boards and chisel the protruding ends level with board. Now I have a board that is easy to work with. By taking a single edge razor blade, I can strip the board of the gold and silver or such. These strippings I put into a clear plastic bag and at my leisure, I further check the strippings and cut off any solder or such. Then I melt the whole deal after weighing the strippings to about l oz or a little better. True, I don't get 99.9% pure but it does give me a good feeling to see the gold buttons. I have taken the buttons to a jeweler and he sort of off-handed gave me an appraisal of the button which he said would probably be about 75% of value. Of course, the button has other materials mixed in such as a few drops of mercury, a little tin, a bit of silver, etc. But the end result is, I have some gold and silver buttons and they are worth what I want them to be--that is, since I have SS and retirement, it is great to see the buttons and have given me a tremendous amount of self-satisfaction with the obvious dangers of killing/maiming/disabling myself trying to get a few bucks off the board. Best part is, I don't have a lot of money wrapped up, I am not hurting the land/air/water and I have a lot of enjoyment. So, having said that, let me recommend that, unless you are willing to take a little over a long period of time, leave the acids, the burning, the dropping, etc. with the professionals and be happy with the realization that you can get what you want without hurting yourself.
Charles Ottaway- Perkins, Oklahoma
2007
Charles; I too am in to the safer side of this spectrum and am interested in some more of your input. I've read every word of this letter and I am exited that someone out there feels the way I do, peeling the gold plating off the boards is personally a novel idea I've done it and its not that hard once you get the hang of it! what I would like to know is where would be the best place to sell my stuff?
Jerry seifriedrecycler - Tulsa, Oklahoma
February 11, 2008
After reading these letters about people possibly hurting or poisoning themselves by trying to recover gold and other precious metals from PCB's and other scrap electronics, I would also like to point out that even crushing or smashing integrated circuits to gain access to precious metal can be hazardous. The packages of some high power transistors and integrated circuits are made from poisonous materials such as arsenic and breathing the dust or even getting it in your eyes or mouth can cause health problems over time and repeated exposure. Taking these parts to proper facilities is very good advice.
Vern Evenselectronics technologist - Calgary, Alberta, Canada
February 19, 2008
I have dissolved some computer chips in aqua regia. then I added urea to neutralize the nitric acid. after that I added the sodium metabisulphate to extract the gold but nothing happened, just some white sediment on the bottom. I can not figure out what I did wrong, maybe there was solder in the mix. I do not know. please if anyone can help me out, it would be greatly appreciated.
Syzmon Wysockihobbyist - Sarasota, Florida
February 19, 2008
DO NOT-EVER! SEND YOUR SCRAP TO A REFINER- YOU WILL ONLY BE PAID FOR ABOUT 40%-60% OF WHAT THEY RECOVER! CHECK THE FBI INVESTIGATIONS OF THE LAST 16 MO.- THESE COMPANIES ARE CROOKS!
DISSOLVE IN NITRIC ACID, POUR LIQUID INTO ANOTHER CONTAINER, ADD ZINC POWDER, FILTER, DRY, SMELT, REMOVE SLUDGE- THERE IS YOUR GOLD! DO NOT THROW AWAY THE LIQUID- YOU CAN REPROCESS. DO NOT THROW AWAY THE REMAINS OF THE FIRST CONTAINER- SILVER OR OTHER METALS.
OR....
ELECTROLYSIS- THIN GOLD CATHODE, FLAT MATERIAL ANODE- 20-30 AMP @ 3 VDC. USE THE LIXIVIANT OF YOUR CHOICE.
OR THERE IS A UNIT YOU CAN GET FOR UNDER $5K THAT WILL SEPARATE 3 DIFFERENT PRECIOUS METALS AT THE SAME TIME. WORTH IT IF YOU PLAN ON DOING IT FOR REAL.
R&D - Boca Raton, Florida
March 1, 2008
There are honest and dishonest people in every field, Russ; but giant corporations entrust their millions of dollars of precious metals to refiners.
But it's also true that it's hard to appraise the value of metals you are sending to a refinery, so the operators probably do have a stronger temptation to cheat than most businesses.
Ted Mooney, P.E.
Striving to live Aloha
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
March 1, 2008
March 5, 2008
Ted, I agree. But, the honest ones- ARE honest when dealing with BIG corporate $$$. If you're not BIG corporate- you are screwed- for now. At least until- several refiners go to jail.
I do APPLAUD all those who give the advice to avoid this as a hobby. The ecological apathy and negligence toward the toxic by-products is inherent to the "shade tree" refiner. We need to be responsible toward our planet- even in the face of losing money!
For the hobbyist, remember this- it is a FEDERAL FELONY to dispose of toxic waste. For those that just think toxic waste comes from nuclear power plants- look it up in a dictionary. Anything that can CONTAMINATE the environment- is a toxic waste.
Now that being said- I will impart some info. I you do decide to proceed as a hobbyist- do not use cyanide...do not use lead...use goggles
⇦this on
eBay or
Amazon [affil links] ...use RESPIRATOR filter...use chemist apron
⇦this on
eBay or
Amazon [affil links]
and rubber gloves
⇦this on
eBay or
Amazon [affil links] ...have at least two CHEMICAL fire extinguishers...go small- do small batches at a time...always neutralize chlorides, nitrates, acids, and sulfides immediately!...DO NOT STORE- take to your local chemical disposer!
Remember- it will just take one person to smell the fumes and call the fire department- then- you will be ticketed and prosecuted by 4 different government agencies!
This is the cost of refining- if you can't afford it- don't do it. If you're going to do it- do it right.
This is just some general info for safety- sorry, but I can't explain the process in detail- I do not need anymore competition!
I am happy to share any general info with anybody- knowledge is and should be free. If anyone has non-specific questions, I'll be happy to answer. You can post here.
Save yourself, by saving your planet!
R&D - Boca Raton, Florida
I want to know where can I find a computer salvage lot. I wanted to get scrap computer parts. Thanks.
Andrew Tiong- Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
March 7, 2008
So the best way to make any money off old e-waste as I read these many posts is to find a cheap or free source of computer parts and sell them on eBay for the people who do want to take all the risks? What is the realistic or average take (how much would I probably make as gross) by selling on eBay , if the buyer gave me a fair price for the parts? (Plus they pay for the shipping)
Craig Whitehead- Mars Hill, North Carolina
March 22, 2008
I am a University student who has acquired several hundred pounds of WWII electronic parts made of silver or with a high silver content. I want to get the silver from these parts in the most efficient and economical manner possible. I have thought of using the parts as the anode in a plating process and "plate OUT" the silver...is this possible?
Bill FarrellUniversity student - Missoula, Montana
March 23, 2008
April 2, 2008
HI
I M A STUDENT OF B.SC WANT TO REFINE GOLD FROM SUBZERO AQUA REGIA. I HAVE BEEN SPEND ENOUGH MONEY TO GET GOLD FROM COMPUTER CIRCUIT BOARD
. I ALSO PURCHASED SUBZERO , STORM PRECIPITANT FROM SHOR INTERNATIONAL COMPANY. please TELL THAT IN 6 liters OF HCl HOW MUCH SUBZERO IS DISSOLVED. TELL ME THE GOLD RICHEST PART OF COMPUTER CIRCUIT BOARD. please ITS URGENT.
REPLY TO ME SOON
STUDENT - LAHORE, PAKISTAN
Regards to all those thinking of refining gold from computer scrap and do not want to use chemicals the amalgamation process is one that I use and have very good results from its very simple and chemical free. The basics are this after reducing the computer boards from any excess metal parts like aluminum or tin connectors and excess chips ( ceramic that contain gold wiring ) I then immerse the boards fingers pins and crushed chips into an amalgamate mixture which a metal mixture ( lead free ) that has been heated in a cast iron pot to melting temp the amalgamate absorbs all precious metals the scrap base metals board material and such collects on the top as slag once the amalgamate has absorbed its weight in pm it will become very thick temperatures have to be watched carefully as the amount of heat to keep the mixture melted will raise as the percentage of pm is absorbed. Once fully saturated the dore (amalgamate and pm) is crushed and then cupled to remove the amalgamate from the pm which will bead in the center of the cupel. Once the pm is recovered I suggest having it refined by pros. By my calculations the percentage of gold on older computer boards is roughly 1% less as the age decreases. if you have a large supply of electronic scrap you can actually make a good amount of money without doing anything visit eBay and look at the prices people are getting for their scrap by those of us that are more experienced at recovering the pm for example one auction for a 20 lb box of parts went for roughly 500.00 the main point is be safe there are fumes that are very harmful to you and others even with the no chemical method of amalgamy the resigns and boards will smoke when the pm are being separated into the amalgamate mixture which by the way is way cheaper than chemicals.
Floyd Greene- Redmond, Oregon
April 27, 2008
April 5, 2008
HI
I want to extract gold from computer circuit boards through subzero aqua regia method.
now I want to ask some question.
Which is the richest part of gold in PCB?
HOW I clean the PCB from excessive or needless things?
And in 6 litre of muriatic acid how much subzero is dissolved?
please tell me if any one of one you knows. Reply me as soon as possible, because I have spend enough money and time on it.
student - Lahore, Pakistan
May 19, 2008
Well just call me a dumb redneck, I took everything on the circuit boards, cracked open processors, smashed circuits, all the gold plated pins, plug inns, memory cards, sound cards, video cards,name it if I thought there was gold in it, on it, around it, near it, I even melted green coating from the mother board with a low temp with a torch, then peeled off the circuit mess off the board,well no gold on that I found out, I put everything in a metal bowl 9 inches around and 4 1/4 deep, and put a cutting torch under it adjusted the torch so it wouldn't melt the bowl, all the pins never melted, all that mesh never melted, anything silver and gold and any lead melted first, I poured it out into another bowl and started melting again, Yea I got gold, yep sure did, from all the parts I used I ended up with 1.75 grams, it was fun,but cost me more in fuel for my cutting touch, and wasting a day melting, wasted all my time saving all that junk for a 1.75 gram, took a day,approx $70.00 worth, I make a $150 to $200 a day painting houses, hey I lost money, So I got smart started buying gold in 1/2 grams coins and in 1 grams bars, and save it let it make me money instead of costing me money, take the advice from a Redneck, just go buy some gold and wait tell it increases in value and sale it, or just get a loan on it. after all who won't loan on gold it's gold, take $40.00 or $80.00 from your pay check and buy 1 or 2 grams each payday or once a month it goes up in value, buy it before it gets any higher as of May 19, 2008 $905 an oz and $40 a gram.
Oh my question is: does anyone agree to leave it to the pro's or people with experience,Just go buy your gold friend, don't waist your time or your money, It takes a lots of processors and old ram cards, sound cards, video cards, modems etc etc, can you say pick up bed full and flat 16 foot trailer full of computer parts to really pay off, but then the right process take a lot of your pay off, Your recovery is like playing the Lotto you spend a lot to win but do you do anything more then brake even, after your time and expense,but we all have had gold fever and a dream. But if you must then be careful.
Redneck point of view.
- Texas
May 19, 2008
First to explain my situation, my dad owned an electronic store that processed a lot of old electronics. Over the years he amassed a huge amount of electronics he intended to scrap. The infamous scrap pile has been sitting outside for years and is most likely not of much value to anyone wanting to have vintage electronics.
Back when I was working for him, I would scrap tons of electronics, mainly for the components which he sold in the store but also for aluminum, copper etc. All the circuit boards would be cleaned of aluminum, excess waste material etc and at one point we took a trailer load to Salt Lake City to be refined. My question is if any one knows of a reputable refiner that can process a lot of circuit boards? Most of the electronics are from the 70s and 80s so the plating is a lot thicker then it is today or even in the 90s.
Also, he had stored a couple tons of prepped boards in a warehouse on the property that burned down. Most of the waste from the fire was thrown away although there is a large pile of burnt material still there that should have some gold present. Is it worth doing anything with this material or should we just get rid of it?
hobbyist - Fort Collins, Colorado
To all that have got the GOLD recovery from computers BUG, I came across this site from a friend of mine in California, I have read a lot of questions & comments concerning this subject. I read response from a gentleman in Freeport Maine, I have to agree with him. My wife and I are the former owners of two large tech recovery here in New England, one in southern Maine and one in New Hampshire. The facility in Maine was called Cyberjunk, it was only for the recovery of electronic waste, we were generating approximately five hundred to six hundred thousand pounds of scrap circuit boards a year. We processed our own metals, gold, silver, platinum,palladium and others. We extracted and processed the plated components at Cyberjunk, the rest of the circuit board was shipped to our refiner in Philadelphia named Abington Metals, the process to extract/leaching or recovering the metals can be VERY DANGEROUS AND VERY TOXIC, my wife and I have a very extensive background in chemistry and the danger involved if these chemicals should mishandled.
If you don't know how to handle the chemicals you can get very badly burned or killed, if you can sell your scrape board and gold components, sell them. God bless all of you for wanting make money, we wish all of you people the success you all deserve! please be careful and leave the gold processing to an EPA permitted facility.
- Houlton, Maine
May 27, 2008
Hello all,
Like everyone else here I have a few tons of archaic technology that I am interested in refining. A good bit of the stuff is specialized
(custom built) pre 1980s, some telephone equipment and it has lots of good looking contacts, ICs, etc. After looking into the DIY and reading Mr. Mooney's and other advice, I'm interested in leaving the refining to the professionals. I don't mind separating the boards and worthwhile chips. Just for kicks I stripped a few pins and etched the copper out of them to see how feasible it was. On a microscale its effective, but hardly worth the effort, even if my time cost next to nothing as the etching solutions (cu or Fe based w/ H202 I think) aren't cheap. (not to mention they are lethal to aquatic life). Even then I'd miss some metals. I have been researching refineries around me and I'm wondering who to turn to. I understand heat can be tricky because if its run too hot the gold sublimes and is lost, not to mention what's trapped in slag, highway robbery etc. I'm wondering if cyanide extraction is more efficient than heat? Is there a drawback to CN such as other pgms lost?
I am in Baltimore Md. CD&E is the only CN facility I can find nearby. Anyone done any business with them? Other suggestions I had are Gemark, Abington Metals (from one of the postings on here). I'm not trying to truck this stuff to Canada or much further than NY unless it makes that much difference. I'm also wondering if these businesses will want to deal with me, a small timer without even a business license, over basically a ton or so of processed material minus housings, etc. I understand with assay and processing fees it can hurt a small load like this. Anyone have any positive experiences or good contacts (pun intended) at these facilities,? Drop me a line.
Someone mentioned a broker, but I feel like there are already too many middlemen involved, though if you've gotten a square deal from one let me know. Again, I'm looking for someone near Baltimore Md who can process these contacts, boards etc and won't lose the pgms OR HURT THE ENVIRONMENT, and I definitely don't want this stuff to end up polluting some village in India or China. Thanks for you time, and best of luck to all of you. This has been a real adventure between learning chemistry and business. Most of all be safe and conscious of your impact on the world around you. I look forward to your thoughts,
- Baltimore, Maryland
June 3, 2008
Hello people,
There are great questions and good answers on this site.
From my personal experience-take your scrap to a refiner. The first time we did this I hooked up with a local man (a real & dangerous crook) one who will hurt you for the gold. Spent a ton of money on supplies and chemicals to have "him " run off with the end product and leave me with a real mess and almost bankrupt.
My next experience was a lot better. I hauled in 3000 lbs of computer/electronic scrap to Sipi metals (a refiner) in Chicago Ill. 45 days latter I received my check for my precious metals along with my cat converter scrap check. This is still the better way to do business unless you want to take a chance possibly with your life.
Hope this helps.
- Hillsdale, Michigan
June 10, 2008
Mr. Akron
I came looking on how to and decided that recovering myself is out of the questions. We recycle old electronics and such on a small scale about 3 tons + a month. Currently we strip copper wire, aluminum heatsinks and light steel off our scrap boards. My question is what other items would be worth pulling off these CBs prior to us turning them in to our local metal yard and possibly where could these items be sent from our location.
We attempt to sell worthwhile items in various venues HD, FDD, CD/DVD if they do not sell, it takes me about 3 minutes to tears these apart into base components and recycle them for PCB, aluminum and light steel.
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated as I do the recycling to supplement my income. Any increase would be a plus. Thanks in advance for your time.
On a side note the thought of these non professional people playing with highly toxic and dangerous chemicals frightens me. Where are they dumping the Waste?
- Thornton, Colorado
June 10, 2008
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